IRC log of musicbrainz on 2007-04-25

Timestamps are in UTC.

00:01:30 [ruaok]
* ruaok snickers at http://youtube.com/watch?v=l3KIxzCqYqM
00:05:37 [BrianFreud]
LOL
00:05:50 [BrianFreud]
your office? :P
00:06:12 [Kerensky97]
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00:06:40 [ruaok]
my office is small enough that only a couch, some servers, my computer and I fit in it.
00:07:18 [BrianFreud]
take out the servers and you'd have mine :P
00:11:24 [murdos]
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00:26:15 [ruaok]
* ruaok goes home for a bike ride
00:26:17 [ruaok]
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00:31:06 [BrianFreud]
servers behaving itself atm guys :)
00:31:31 [rpedro__]
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00:31:32 [Muz]
Hahahah
00:31:36 [Muz]
That youtube clip ftw
00:34:54 [toxickore]
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01:24:05 [drsaunde]
Raptors Win! Raptors Win!
01:27:39 [BrianFreud]
damn, the site is SCREAMING!
01:29:50 [Shepard`]
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01:36:31 [BrianFreud]
Is there an equivalent for [traditional] that covers Xmas traditional songs?
01:39:02 [BrianFreud]
ah, found it :)
01:44:32 [Jugdish]
what is it?
01:45:23 [BrianFreud]
closest I can find is under SP artist [spiritual] : http://musicbrainz.org/track/d1c993b4-bd1e-4cc1-b4ac-1e9da7465dcf.html
01:45:48 [rpedro]
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01:47:24 [BrianFreud]
seems as good a target as any, since the artist atribution on the track is [traditional], rather than any one artist
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01:56:28 [BrianFreud]
Jugdish: only thing that would seem to make it possibly a better target would be a generic release as well as the generic artists
01:56:50 [BrianFreud]
argh, server slowing way down again
01:57:00 [nofeardjb]
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01:57:50 [nofeardjb]
How do i clear out Picard's database? It crashed badly and won't get Cd info from the online databases anymore
01:58:13 [BrianFreud]
how do you mean "clear out"
01:58:21 [BrianFreud]
it goes to empty when you exit the prog
01:59:15 [nofeardjb]
when i load it up, there are five entries under "albums" that say "[loading album information]" but nothing happens.. and when i add more music, they never get info from the internet
01:59:31 [BrianFreud]
the server's been having trouble lately, it's nothing on your end
01:59:42 [nofeardjb]
hmm
01:59:44 [BrianFreud]
ruoak's been trying to fix it for 2 weeks or so now
01:59:57 [nofeardjb]
/sigh i thought it was me
02:00:03 [BrianFreud]
unfortunately, no
02:00:10 [BrianFreud]
though, one thing you might want to do
02:00:13 [nofeardjb]
yes?
02:00:13 [BrianFreud]
you using windows?
02:00:15 [nofeardjb]
no
02:00:20 [nofeardjb]
linux ubuntu
02:00:28 [BrianFreud]
ok, I don't know where picard stores it under linux,
02:00:36 [nofeardjb]
hehe
02:00:45 [nofeardjb]
what were you going to suggest anyway? just curious
02:00:53 [BrianFreud]
but esp when picardqt's having issues contacting the server, the log file get filled to hell
02:01:02 [BrianFreud]
mine have been eating up 40-50 mb a day
02:01:03 [nofeardjb]
i'll check it out
02:01:10 [BrianFreud]
it's worth finding them and deleting them
02:01:14 [BrianFreud]
the other thing you might try
02:01:21 [BrianFreud]
is to go into your options in QT,
02:01:36 [BrianFreud]
and set the server (if you're just trying to do lookups) to www.uk.musicbrainz.org
02:01:44 [BrianFreud]
that server works, but doesn't allow edits
02:01:55 [nofeardjb]
ok i'll check that out as well
02:01:58 [BrianFreud]
:)
02:02:03 [nofeardjb]
you've been very helpful! ;-)
02:02:13 [BrianFreud]
no prob
02:02:54 [Jugdish]
anybody here use foobar2000?
02:03:18 [BrianFreud]
nope
02:03:41 [BrianFreud]
winamp all the way :)
02:03:48 [Jugdish]
heh
02:03:54 [nofeardjb]
amarok is nice in linux
02:04:09 [BrianFreud]
lol, never get me off winamp... been using it since alpha1 :P
02:04:40 [BrianFreud]
back when it was either use your computer, or play music, but not both :P
02:05:54 [BrianFreud]
anyone remember ampmp3?
02:10:42 [nofeardjb]
hey brain
02:10:52 [nofeardjb]
picard finally started working again ;-)
02:10:57 [Jugdish]
brain?
02:10:58 [BrianFreud]
:)
02:11:08 [BrianFreud]
lol, I get that typo all the time, used to it
02:11:14 [Jugdish]
:P
02:11:43 [BrianFreud]
used to play an online game called pyroto... got that typo so often I ended up changing my nice to Brain Food
02:11:43 [nofeardjb]
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02:11:48 [BrianFreud]
*/nick
02:42:01 [BrianFreud]
Anyone here an expert on entering Musicals into MB?
02:48:55 [ajh]
there's no reason at all to have unsorted files in a dir structure is there? all in one would just load faster anyway right?
02:49:07 [ajh]
other than name conflicts I suppose.
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02:52:14 [BrianFreud]
I use TheGodfather to take advantage of what tags do exist, so I can try to ID them later
02:52:34 [BrianFreud]
easier than all in one dir
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02:53:41 [ajh]
Yeah, I'm thinking about those left-over once I've already identified most of them.
02:53:56 [BrianFreud]
that's the ones I mean
02:53:57 [ajh]
wish changing configs was easier...
02:54:01 [BrianFreud]
I have around 10k of them
02:54:21 [ajh]
heh, 99% of mine are off original discs.
02:54:29 [BrianFreud]
but the more I can take advantage of what I *do* know about them, the easier they are to add in to the db and manually get tagged
02:54:53 [ajh]
yeah, but I mostly want to be able to easily remove dupes etc.
02:55:00 [ajh]
which this doesn't really facilitate
02:55:32 [BrianFreud]
see, I find it does, for the ID'd ones - load all into QT, save elsewhere, delete what remains, move em all back
02:55:39 [ktwilight_]
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02:56:04 [ajh]
Well that's what I'm doing, but not all the 'what remains' is junk.
02:56:15 [ajh]
I'm moving all complete albums into their own tree.
02:56:16 [ktwilight_]
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02:56:17 [BrianFreud]
oh, sorry, I left out a step
02:56:25 [BrianFreud]
ID all I can into one dir,
02:56:31 [BrianFreud]
then re-run all those to a different dir,
02:56:35 [BrianFreud]
delete the interim dir
02:56:48 [ajh]
Well, yeah that's the plan... just lots of config changing :)
02:56:50 [BrianFreud]
and manually add/ID the leftovers in the original dir
02:56:54 [BrianFreud]
yup
02:56:55 [BrianFreud]
lol
02:57:08 [ajh]
that's why we need persistent target directory trees on the album side. :)
02:57:31 [BrianFreud]
why?
02:57:45 [BrianFreud]
well, I guess in other OSes it'd help, but in windows, I just drag from the explorer side
02:57:52 [ajh]
Then you could setup different 'libraries' on the right, and setup different naming structures etc for them.
02:57:57 [BrianFreud]
I'm glad there isn't a persistant tree, it'd just get in my way
02:58:01 [ajh]
that and the not having to reload all the time.
02:58:17 [ajh]
well, you have the big ones collapseable.
02:58:21 [BrianFreud]
* BrianFreud wouldn't want Picard to load all 100k tracks in RAM each and every time
03:06:23 [ajh]
Still wish I could generate a list of which discs to re-rip
03:06:40 [ajh]
somehow so many i know I have complete discs of have tracks missing.
03:06:52 [pankkake]
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03:08:17 [BrianFreud]
the way I do it, after I run that entire earlier process,
03:08:34 [BrianFreud]
I then hand select each which is 17/17 complete, and save them elsewhere
03:08:42 [BrianFreud]
anything left, I know is missing a track somewhere
03:09:04 [ktwilight]
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03:09:50 [BrianFreud]
long and annoying process, but worthwhile in the long run
03:10:40 [ajh]
yeah, that's what i'm doing but I'm saying that the UI needs to do better... it's the 21st century, norton commander is 20 years old now, time for looking at the semantic web. )
03:12:16 [BrianFreud]
well, just keep in mind, right now luks' still working on stability and other issues
03:12:25 [BrianFreud]
the QT ui is a MASSIVE improvement over the prior UI
03:12:54 [ajh]
Yes, it's more a different way of viewing data, and I wouldn't place the whole task like this on one person anyway.
03:13:21 [BrianFreud]
lol, welcome to MB :P
03:13:56 [BrianFreud]
if you know how to program, I'm sure he'd appreciate your contribution :)
03:14:57 [BrianFreud]
wish I could - my programming's only good enough to be able to figure out what is causing bugs, rather than just reporting em
03:15:29 [ajh]
Yeah, you really don't want me writing code, lousy with syntax... fine with design and debugging/troubleshooting though :)
03:15:47 [ajh]
You'd be amazed at how many things I pestered into gnome :)
03:17:14 [ajh]
the more I think about it though the more exporting a list of incomplete rips would help me, I could probably re-rip with less hassle than doing all this.
03:18:03 [ajh]
but like the operation I'm doing now, with the current UI I estimate 6-7 hours to finish, if it sorted based on completeness, 2 minutes and an hour of waiting.
03:18:28 [ajh]
and considering the current demands on my time, it's a fairly critical thing.
03:22:56 [BrianFreud]
well, do you know python?
03:23:43 [BrianFreud]
what you could do is write a python plugin to export data as you go, then give you a report
03:23:53 [ktwilight_]
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03:24:01 [BrianFreud]
aCiD2 is planning to write a util to plug into to QT to do that and a whole lot more
03:24:22 [ajh]
not well enough to do that... I mostly look for where the crash is happening with things :)
03:26:09 [ajh]
but the more work I put into this, the more I think I just want to go buy a nice quad-G5 and re-rip everything to FLAC.
03:26:13 [BrianFreud]
exactly the same as me - I can say WHY it happens... I just can't fix it
03:26:19 [BrianFreud]
lol
03:26:23 [BrianFreud]
this way's cheaper :P
03:26:31 [ajh]
For you perhaps.
03:26:46 [ajh]
It's taken almost a week of time so far, that could have paid for a G5.
03:27:05 [ajh]
but then, I'm doing it to learn where things sit with taggers etc anyway.
03:27:43 [BrianFreud]
* BrianFreud wishes he had a job where 1 week = G5
03:27:55 [ajh]
Heh, it's not every week :)
03:27:58 [BrianFreud]
lol
03:28:01 [BrianFreud]
what do you do?
03:28:57 [ajh]
Lots of things, some would be http://www.linuxsymposium.org/ another http://www.gccsummit.org/ and http://www.desktopcon.org/ as well as http://www.steamballoon.com/ and some mountain guiding/climbing instruction in my free time.
03:29:05 [BrianFreud]
nice
03:29:21 [BrianFreud]
I was in IT sales for 4 or 5 years, but the money got so bad, I quit recently
03:29:26 [BrianFreud]
looking for a new job now
03:29:31 [ajh]
Desktop integration has been a big thing for awhile now for me.
03:29:56 [BrianFreud]
how do you mean?
03:30:20 [ajh]
Well, semantic web, seamless data-conduits, interop, internationalization, etc.
03:30:20 [BrianFreud]
Not sure I know what desktop integration is
03:30:27 [BrianFreud]
ah, ok
03:30:41 [ajh]
Basically turning the desktop in a set of interface definitions.
03:31:04 [BrianFreud]
sounds fun :)
03:31:09 [cooperaa]
beat StarCraft episode I! :)
03:31:12 [ajh]
Frustrating more like it :)
03:31:17 [BrianFreud]
props :)
03:31:21 [cooperaa]
hehe
03:31:22 [ajh]
Have you used F-Spot yet?
03:31:29 [BrianFreud]
F-Spot? never heard of it
03:31:35 [ajh]
That's more the UI style I would have thought for this.
03:31:42 [BrianFreud]
* BrianFreud pays a quick trip to google
03:32:14 [ajh]
Kinda like a free version of Picasa.
03:32:35 [BrianFreud]
ah, I see
03:32:42 [BrianFreud]
here, let me find you the right picard page,
03:32:49 [BrianFreud]
you can see where the ui has been/is going
03:33:05 [BrianFreud]
http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/IntuitivePicardInterface?highlight=%28ui%29%7C%28picard%29
03:33:41 [BrianFreud]
you could always throw your ideas for a ui together and add them into the wiki
03:34:03 [ajh]
Honestly adding sort criteria and bulk operations would make a night and day difference before anything else.
03:34:31 [ajh]
So sort by title, completeness, length, artist, etc. LIke how almost every email programme etc does it.
03:34:32 [BrianFreud]
I know sort is high on luks' list
03:34:40 [BrianFreud]
but to this point, stability has been the priority
03:34:48 [BrianFreud]
earlier alphas were... rather unstable
03:34:52 [ajh]
I'm surprised the qt widget he's using doesn't basically give it free.
03:35:05 [cooperaa]
BrianFreud: I actually found earlier alphas were more stable than the current (8)
03:35:14 [BrianFreud]
not once you add in the analyze functionaliyu
03:35:19 [BrianFreud]
really?
03:35:29 [cooperaa]
there is probably no logical reason for that, but it never crashed with 16,000 songs in the early alphas for me
03:35:30 [BrianFreud]
I always crashed on all of em, except for 6 and 8
03:35:34 [cooperaa]
now it crashes around 5,000 :P
03:35:46 [cooperaa]
(but I haven't tried analyzing yet)
03:35:57 [BrianFreud]
cooperaa: I've loaded 20k files w/o a crash
03:35:59 [ajh]
I just look at this and think it's an endless task to finish.
03:36:01 [cooperaa]
nice
03:36:01 [BrianFreud]
in alpha8
03:36:10 [ojnkpjg]
it'd probably take like 30 minutes to add alternate sorts
03:36:27 [BrianFreud]
I've tweaked my system a bit, but now I only crash if I try to analyze more than 10 files at a time
03:36:28 [ajh]
Just because I can't sort on completeness.
03:36:44 [ajh]
Wierd, I set analyze going on 1200 at once.
03:36:53 [ajh]
I've only seen one crash so far actually.
03:37:03 [BrianFreud]
see? unstable, and not for consistant reasons
03:37:09 [BrianFreud]
that's what luks is trying to fix atm
03:37:10 [ajh]
Could be the 4 gigs of ram.
03:37:14 [BrianFreud]
give him a month or two
03:37:23 [ajh]
The instability I've seen is with the ui and the keyboard shortcuts mostly.
03:37:29 [BrianFreud]
see, I'm running a dual 1 ghz cpu w/ 768 ram
03:38:00 [BrianFreud]
biggest annoyance for me is the inconsistancy with when it drags and when it just multi selects
03:38:27 [ajh]
yeah, that's annoying, but being able to sort would let me finish this in 5% the total time.
03:38:36 [BrianFreud]
lol
03:38:46 [BrianFreud]
like I say, just give luks some time
03:38:51 [cooperaa]
I just want it to recognize when MP3s are already tagged :(
03:38:52 [BrianFreud]
I know it's on the list to be done
03:39:05 [BrianFreud]
cooperaa: it isn't for you?
03:39:08 [BrianFreud]
never had a problem here
03:39:16 [cooperaa]
serious?!
03:39:19 [cooperaa]
wtf
03:39:31 [BrianFreud]
I use QT as my dupe finder, it works so well at doing that...
03:39:47 [cooperaa]
it shows the checkmarks when you load files that are already tagged?
03:39:52 [BrianFreud]
yup
03:39:59 [cooperaa]
man, I wonder what's wrong with mine
03:40:02 [cooperaa]
you have ffmeg?
03:40:07 [BrianFreud]
windows
03:40:21 [cooperaa]
haha yea it's true... what's wrong with mine is that it's a mac
03:40:34 [BrianFreud]
that's the other part of the problem luks has ajh - 3 dif OSes to support, each w/ different buggyness
03:40:38 [BrianFreud]
same codebase
03:40:52 [cooperaa]
well *nix are all pretty similar
03:40:59 [BrianFreud]
that's why I say 3
03:41:11 [BrianFreud]
OSX is different enought to be separated from linux
03:41:13 [cooperaa]
mac is unix based though
03:41:17 [BrianFreud]
lol
03:41:20 [BrianFreud]
you read my mind :P
03:41:23 [cooperaa]
:)
03:41:23 [ajh]
yeah, I'm hoping the backend functionality is all library based.
03:41:52 [BrianFreud]
read yesterday's logs - aCid2 was compiling it on OSX, luks was walking him through it
03:42:10 [cooperaa]
was he using the guide?
03:42:15 [BrianFreud]
not sure
03:42:23 [BrianFreud]
acid needed to patch in a fix that luks has in alpha9
03:42:27 [cooperaa]
I hope so! I wrote it for a reason! :)
03:42:39 [BrianFreud]
he was writing an official version of a plugin he threw together for me
03:42:53 [BrianFreud]
adds in cdbaby / archive cover art support
03:42:58 [cooperaa]
the archive art one?
03:43:02 [cooperaa]
ya cool :)
03:43:03 [BrianFreud]
yes
03:43:11 [cooperaa]
I think I saw you guys discussin that
03:43:14 [BrianFreud]
you have pythonmusicbrainz installed?
03:43:37 [cooperaa]
don't think so
03:43:40 [BrianFreud]
ah
03:43:40 [cooperaa]
luks said you don't need it?
03:43:49 [cooperaa]
(he took it out of the install guide anyways)
03:44:02 [ajh]
ugh, perhaps I should just go skiing and wait then :)
03:44:06 [BrianFreud]
the hacked version does, since luks didn't include url-rels in the req from MB
03:44:12 [BrianFreud]
the official version won't need it
03:44:25 [cooperaa]
cool
03:44:29 [cooperaa]
I don't use rels atm
03:44:35 [cooperaa]
makes loading the albums take longer ;)
03:44:39 [BrianFreud]
hacked version basically does a second http req for the url-reqs
03:44:49 [cooperaa]
when I can tag them once and have it recognize that they are tagged properly, then I'll load the rels
03:45:03 [BrianFreud]
see, I wish the opposite
03:45:11 [BrianFreud]
since I move between dirs when I use for dupe check,
03:45:29 [BrianFreud]
the checks make it hard to tell if it's already in the right place or not
03:45:38 [BrianFreud]
have to use the hourglass cursor as an indicator
03:46:14 [cooperaa]
poor MusicBrainz :( 502s make me cry
03:46:36 [BrianFreud]
cooperaa: by the way, was it you who told me in an edit note to read the label wiki page?
03:46:41 [BrianFreud]
or was that panda?
03:46:44 [cooperaa]
not me
03:46:51 [BrianFreud]
k
03:46:57 [BrianFreud]
hey, off topic...
03:47:12 [cooperaa]
although its probably a good idea.. I've just scanned it (so much content!)
03:47:16 [BrianFreud]
what are the dumbest errors you guys have found in the db lately?
03:47:33 [BrianFreud]
cooperaa: no, I agree... there's just one sentence that totally makes no sense to me
03:47:49 [cooperaa]
dumbest errors? idunno hard to recall any standout ones
03:47:58 [BrianFreud]
here's my top two:
03:48:03 [BrianFreud]
(finds links)
03:48:59 [BrianFreud]
haven't had time yet to fix this one, but it's worth a laugh: http://musicbrainz.org/release/dec4e5e8-640c-42aa-af69-a773c32252ab.html
03:49:54 [ajh]
Sigh, I've probably got 50 albums to submit.
03:50:27 [BrianFreud]
lol, tis nothing :P
03:50:35 [cooperaa]
I've only got one and I managed to sneak it in ;)
03:50:35 [ajh]
At least it's not as bad as when I first used CDDB, then I had to enter 99% of everything I ripped.
03:50:44 [BrianFreud]
* BrianFreud looks at the excel file with 671 releases yet to be added
03:51:20 [cooperaa]
BrianFreud: my goodnes... good luck cleaning that up! don't forget ;)
03:51:42 [BrianFreud]
oh, trust me, it's on the list
03:51:47 [BrianFreud]
ok, 502 getting the other
03:51:49 [BrianFreud]
but try this
03:52:14 [BrianFreud]
it's a recording of the original london cast doing the musical We Will Rock You
03:52:24 [BrianFreud]
someone just dumped it kit and kaboodle into Queen
03:52:38 [BrianFreud]
I moved it for the moment, but it needs a lot more long term help
03:52:40 [cooperaa]
oooh speaking of brutal
03:52:46 [cooperaa]
there's a U2 TRIBUTE album
03:52:52 [BrianFreud]
in U2?
03:52:52 [BrianFreud]
lol
03:52:52 [cooperaa]
**IN** U2's page!
03:52:55 [BrianFreud]
yup
03:53:05 [BrianFreud]
see, my worry is,
03:53:12 [cooperaa]
(granted, I searched several reputable sources and none had the performer info ;) )
03:53:19 [BrianFreud]
it's taking me SO much time to just fix nirvana
03:53:30 [BrianFreud]
everyone has their pet projects,
03:53:36 [cooperaa]
yup
03:53:38 [BrianFreud]
and we're all still adding more than fixing
03:53:49 [BrianFreud]
esp for the small artists,
03:53:50 [cooperaa]
yes, I definitely notice that as well
03:53:55 [BrianFreud]
when will they ever get fixed?
03:54:04 [BrianFreud]
take the collab of the month...
03:54:04 [cooperaa]
the only time I "fix" is when I get a subscription email saying someone made an edit
03:54:09 [ajh]
when the UI makes it easy. :)
03:54:11 [cooperaa]
then I go look and get annoyed and fix stuff
03:54:15 [BrianFreud]
we're doing 2 months on DS
03:54:34 [BrianFreud]
seems it'd make more sense to choose a bunch of 1 release artists,
03:54:40 [BrianFreud]
and make THAT the collab of the month
03:54:53 [BrianFreud]
and I do mean month, not 2 or 3
03:55:07 [BrianFreud]
if we choose 50 1 releasers each month,
03:55:15 [BrianFreud]
and everyone does One of them
03:55:25 [BrianFreud]
then the small timers get the attention they need
03:55:30 [cooperaa]
yup
03:55:38 [BrianFreud]
all DS really needs is a die hard DS fan, like me with Nirvana
03:55:45 [BrianFreud]
The Beatles was a special case
03:55:54 [cooperaa]
but, I think that might be displacing our efforts in a place that doesn't need as much attention/effort
03:56:04 [BrianFreud]
maybe the Grateful Dead, Beatles, Pearl Jam, and Classical need that kind of attention
03:56:11 [BrianFreud]
but Dire Straits???
03:56:25 [BrianFreud]
and 2 whole months?
03:56:35 [cooperaa]
are people still working on DS?
03:56:45 [cooperaa]
I thought the hype died down so no one updated the Wiki
03:56:47 [BrianFreud]
I started, but I got discouraged
03:56:54 [BrianFreud]
was trying to clean up the bootlegs
03:56:56 [Amblin]
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03:56:58 [BrianFreud]
there are 24 in there
03:57:10 [BrianFreud]
10 of them currently use bootlegstyleguide naming,
03:57:12 [BrianFreud]
14 don't
03:57:20 [BrianFreud]
I started correcting the 14 to BSG
03:57:30 [BrianFreud]
ppl were voting against the fixes,
03:57:52 [BrianFreud]
saying "BSG is only a proposal now, voting no til it's an official style"
03:58:03 [BrianFreud]
so instead we stay with inconsistancy
03:58:11 [cooperaa]
lame
03:58:15 [BrianFreud]
Personally, I just said screw it, back to Nirvana
03:58:15 [BrianFreud]
lol
03:58:29 [ajh]
most new people would just quit.
03:58:37 [BrianFreud]
I think BSG is solid enough
03:58:50 [BrianFreud]
What is the process for finally getting the damn thing made official?
03:59:01 [cooperaa]
as far as I'm concerned it's official
03:59:07 [BrianFreud]
if anyone disagrees with it, point them at Nirvana
03:59:35 [BrianFreud]
you can see, looking at Nirvana, how clean it is, using BSG and the extra Nirvana-specific rules for categorization
03:59:47 [BrianFreud]
(which I wrote) lol
04:00:23 [BrianFreud]
extra rules, btw, being: Live" refers to any album which contains only one concert or demo session, or which contains one concert/demo session plus a small number of filler tracks from other sources.
04:00:27 [BrianFreud]
Live" refers to any album which contains only one concert or demo session, or which contains one concert/demo session plus a small number of filler tracks from other sources.
04:00:32 [BrianFreud]
"Compilation" refers to any album which contains tracks from 2 or more concerts or other sources, where there is not a focus on a *single* concert date or demo session. All non-official "Live" releases must therefore have the title named following LiveBootlegStyle.
04:00:32 [BrianFreud]
Studio bootlegs will be listed under the "Other" category.
04:00:54 [BrianFreud]
makes it clear what category each type of boot goes into
04:01:02 [BrianFreud]
and the display looks REALLY clean
04:01:08 [cooperaa]
cool
04:01:23 [BrianFreud]
I've been tempted to add those defs into the BSG, actually
04:01:30 [BrianFreud]
just haven't gotten enough comments on them yet
04:01:34 [drsaunde]
i disagree with listing 2 live shows together as "compilation"
04:01:38 [drsaunde]
that should be live
04:01:48 [cooperaa]
I think so to... but I'd be open to hearing your argument, BrianFreud
04:01:52 [BrianFreud]
well,
04:01:59 [BrianFreud]
the way I've been doing it,
04:02:06 [BrianFreud]
no one CD can ever hold 2 full shows
04:02:15 [BrianFreud]
if there are 2 on one CD,
04:02:26 [drsaunde]
if all the tracks are live then the type is live
04:02:27 [BrianFreud]
either you've got a SNL type show plus a real show,
04:02:29 [cooperaa]
it's still live though
04:02:33 [BrianFreud]
or they left out some
04:02:36 [BrianFreud]
oh, I agree,
04:02:45 [BrianFreud]
but right now, we have overloaded that category
04:02:52 [BrianFreud]
they are Live AND Compilations
04:03:07 [BrianFreud]
but take Outcesticide as an example
04:03:17 [BrianFreud]
It's 24/25 tracks, depending on the release
04:03:20 [BrianFreud]
every single one live
04:03:26 [BrianFreud]
every single one from a different concert
04:03:46 [BrianFreud]
to me, when I have to choose one of the two, that's a compilation, not a live
04:03:53 [BrianFreud]
I think of "live" as a concert
04:04:17 [BrianFreud]
"compilation" I think of as a mix of different *sources*, be they live, demo, studio, official, etc
04:04:20 [cooperaa]
same, but even official live releases can be made up of different performances
04:04:44 [drsaunde]
if the release was "official" it would be classified as live....I don't think there's anything in the manner of bootlegs which would make that fact change
04:04:56 [BrianFreud]
like I say, this is a hack, since right now we force people to choose one or the other
04:04:59 [BrianFreud]
when it really is both
04:05:15 [BrianFreud]
this definition at least makes a clean distinction
04:05:20 [cooperaa]
but I think primarily it is a live release
04:05:28 [cooperaa]
in that every song is live
04:05:36 [BrianFreud]
well, ok, but take an example where you have 20 tracks
04:05:39 [cooperaa]
if you set it as a compilation you're going to have (live) in every track title
04:05:58 [BrianFreud]
15 are live, from different concerts, and 5 are studio, of the 5 studio, 4 are demo, one was a b-side
04:06:02 [BrianFreud]
What is it?
04:06:12 [cooperaa]
compilation
04:06:17 [BrianFreud]
why?
04:06:20 [cooperaa]
(obviously?_
04:06:21 [ajh]
so, who's done a plugin to pipe missing tracks into gnutella? :)
04:06:47 [BrianFreud]
yes, it seems obvious, but just for the point of argument, spell it out a sec :)
04:06:53 [cooperaa]
why? because it is a compilation of seemingly random tracks, live, demos, studio, etc
04:07:11 [drsaunde]
try this brian...search for releases called "Greatest Hits Live"...see how many are live..how many are compilation
04:07:22 [Amblin-]
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04:07:52 [BrianFreud]
no, I know
04:07:57 [cooperaa]
I think Live >> Compilation like drsaunde is saying... because you can have compilations, bootlegs, etc all that are live
04:08:07 [BrianFreud]
Well, think of it this way
04:08:20 [ajh]
* ajh tries to submit albums again.
04:08:20 [BrianFreud]
You're saying that an album that is 75% live is still a compilation.
04:08:20 [cooperaa]
so yes, we should maybe have sub-categories for live releases, but we don;t
04:08:40 [BrianFreud]
What if we make it 19 out of 20 are live, and the 1 that's not is marked (bonus track)
04:08:40 [ajh]
You know, having a separate server for recent submissions then just copying them into the main database might make sense.
04:08:45 [BrianFreud]
is it still a compilation?
04:08:48 [cooperaa]
unless it was originally released as a 15-track live album
04:09:04 [cooperaa]
and they tagged that other stuff on the end for bonus
04:09:08 [BrianFreud]
ajh: you're describing the uk server
04:09:08 [cooperaa]
then I'd say it's live
04:09:28 [BrianFreud]
so what is it about 15/5 vs 19/1 that makes the first a comp and the 2nd live?
04:09:39 [ajh]
If it's really this loaded then perhaps having something highly available would make sense.
04:09:46 [ajh]
if not HA/GeoDiverse.
04:09:49 [BrianFreud]
like I say, it's all grey, cause we're making 1 field cover 2 different categories
04:09:58 [cooperaa]
if the only non-live track is a bonus track, then sure, call it live
04:10:02 [BrianFreud]
that's why I put in a hard and fast rule
04:10:06 [BrianFreud]
it may not be perfect
04:10:13 [BrianFreud]
but it's clear and makes some sense
04:10:13 [cooperaa]
but if there are random tracks and random types of tracks, compilation
04:10:27 [BrianFreud]
well, I cover that in there too
04:10:48 [BrianFreud]
if you have 1 full concert, plus 5 bonus tracks from a different concert, the def treats that as Live
04:11:01 [cooperaa]
how is that different from two live concerts together?
04:11:05 [BrianFreud]
if you have 2+ partial concerts, the def treats that as compilation
04:11:12 [BrianFreud]
full vs partial
04:11:17 [drsaunde]
makes no sense to me
04:11:22 [ajh]
and I've been using the Uk server, but it still sends me to the other one on "lookup"
04:11:24 [cooperaa]
2 full live shows would be live
04:11:29 [BrianFreud]
yes
04:11:32 [BrianFreud]
agreed
04:11:36 [BrianFreud]
I've only run into one of those
04:11:40 [cooperaa]
just like two albums on one disc are still categorized as an album
04:11:44 [drsaunde]
and I hope in that full +5 situation you aren't using the show date of the full show in the title
04:11:44 [BrianFreud]
and I'm still debating how to cover it
04:12:13 [BrianFreud]
drsaude: luckily in every such case, the bootleg labels the +5 as bonus, so I can do it
04:12:19 [BrianFreud]
as per BSG
04:12:35 [BrianFreud]
(every such case *so far*)
04:13:01 [drsaunde]
is that in the guide? I don't remember that and I would remove dates from the titles in those instances
04:13:11 [BrianFreud]
let me find it...
04:15:42 [BrianFreud]
looks like it's been taken out again
04:16:04 [BrianFreud]
there was a section that described ignoring bonus tracks when it came to date naming
04:16:29 [drsaunde]
probably because it didn't make sense
04:16:56 [BrianFreud]
I don't agree...
04:17:00 [cooperaa]
I can see the argument
04:17:03 [BrianFreud]
I've been collecting bootlegs for 15+ years
04:17:06 [drsaunde]
if a show/recording date is in the bootleg title...all the tracks should be from that show
04:17:08 [BrianFreud]
in the bootleg world,
04:17:11 [BrianFreud]
right
04:17:15 [BrianFreud]
in the bootleg world,
04:17:17 [cooperaa]
okay time out
04:17:37 [BrianFreud]
lol
04:17:40 [cooperaa]
:)
04:18:06 [cooperaa]
I think that the date should only be used for shows or some sort of live recording that took place on that date. we all agree there I'm pretty sure
04:18:30 [cooperaa]
if a bootleg recording of that show was released... we would label it YYYY-MM-DD: TItle
04:18:37 [ajh]
The entire concept of albums is going to shift away soon anyway.
04:18:44 [BrianFreud]
Typically, in the bootleg world, it is expected that a disc be FULL. So if a concert ran shorter than a disc can hold, you get bonus tracks. But the disk will still normally advertise, in title, or on the cover, using the date for the main concert on the disk.
04:19:03 [cooperaa]
but then if (somehow) it was re-released with bonus material (perhaps the band's warmup from the day before) then I think it only makes sense to label it the same way like we do with albums
04:19:29 [BrianFreud]
It's like a recording of Mozart's requiem which also happens to have a single sonnet or something on it
04:19:51 [cooperaa]
well we do signify that in classical titles sometimes
04:20:05 [cooperaa]
Requiem / Overtures
04:20:08 [BrianFreud]
well, esp considering how grey bootlegs area anyhow,
04:20:36 [BrianFreud]
If I want the show from date X, that's the most important
04:20:53 [BrianFreud]
normally the bonus tracks are just the spice on the meal
04:21:26 [BrianFreud]
and thus, I think the "meal" is what ought to be reflected in the title listing
04:21:32 [cooperaa]
yup
04:21:54 [BrianFreud]
and that "meal" I treat as live
04:22:03 [drsaunde]
i disagree completely
04:22:06 [BrianFreud]
but when you get smorgasboard - a mix from different shows, dates, etc,
04:22:12 [BrianFreud]
then it's a compilationm, by definition
04:22:34 [drsaunde]
when you go as far as to put a date in the title (and these normally aren't part of any titles), all tracks have to be from that date
04:22:48 [BrianFreud]
* BrianFreud disagrees strongly
04:23:03 [cooperaa]
BrianFreud, it is a compilation but live overrules
04:23:17 [BrianFreud]
where does it say that in the wiki?
04:23:24 [cooperaa]
it doesn't
04:23:28 [BrianFreud]
exactly
04:23:34 [BrianFreud]
main problem is,
04:23:41 [BrianFreud]
we have a totally overloaded field
04:23:44 [cooperaa]
we can't explain every single little detail
04:23:46 [BrianFreud]
it really needs to be two fields
04:23:48 [cooperaa]
yes you're right it is overloaded
04:23:53 [cooperaa]
we need sub-Live categories
04:23:57 [cooperaa]
but we don't have any atm
04:24:16 [BrianFreud]
well, why do I have to choose, for an unplugged album, "Live" or "Official"?
04:24:18 [ajh]
so, once audio is done, is video next? :)
04:24:20 [BrianFreud]
it's both
04:24:22 [cooperaa]
but that doesn't mean can start using the non-Live sub categories for live releases
04:24:31 [cooperaa]
you don
04:24:31 [cooperaa]
tt
04:24:35 [cooperaa]
you set it to Live and Official
04:24:46 [BrianFreud]
oops, you're right
04:24:47 [cooperaa]
Live/Album/Compilation/etc
04:24:55 [BrianFreud]
sorry, thinking the wrong combination
04:25:35 [BrianFreud]
server's 502ing, so I can't pull the list, but offhand, anyone remember the options in that dropdown?
04:25:41 [cooperaa]
it really should be like Live: Compilation / EP / Concert Recording / "album"; Studio: Album / EP / Single / Compilation, etc
04:25:44 [BrianFreud]
ah, got it to let me in...
04:26:04 [cooperaa]
and then you set the release status to Official / Promo / Bootleg
04:26:05 [BrianFreud]
* BrianFreud waits
04:27:18 [drsaunde]
the plan for the future is to be able to select more than one...so you can have Live & Compilation...or Live & Spoken Word..or Compilation and EP..etc
04:27:28 [BrianFreud]
Ok, currently we have: (unknown), Album, Single, EP, Compilation, Soundtrack, Spokenword, Interview, Audiobook, Live, Remix, and Other
04:27:40 [BrianFreud]
i see that list, however, as two groups mixed as one
04:27:46 [cooperaa]
yes it definitey is
04:27:56 [BrianFreud]
It OUGHT to be: (unknown), Album, Single, EP, Compilation, Soundtrack
04:28:05 [BrianFreud]
then separately: (unknown), Spokenword, Interview, Audiobook, Live, Remix, and Other
04:28:08 [drsaunde]
not even
04:28:12 [BrianFreud]
the one describes what it is
04:28:18 [drsaunde]
soundtracks can be compilations or albums...or even live
04:28:19 [BrianFreud]
the other describes the CONTENT of what it is
04:28:21 [drsaunde]
or even EP
04:28:24 [BrianFreud]
I thought about that
04:28:38 [cooperaa]
what we need is to be able to apply multiple attributes to each release, but we cannot
04:28:44 [cooperaa]
so we pick the most appropriate
04:28:53 [drsaunde]
the best way and the plan will be to be able to select all that apply and I know thats in the works for the future
04:28:54 [BrianFreud]
but it's pretty much a given that a soundtrack is either a compilation, or an album specificially written to be a soundtrack
04:29:03 [BrianFreud]
exactly
04:29:14 [BrianFreud]
my definition at least gives some consistancy for the moment
04:29:40 [BrianFreud]
in the future they can always be "corrected" to add in the additional aspects then allowed
04:29:49 [drsaunde]
i disagree...for a release with all tracks live...most everyone familiar with the database will look for these under live
04:30:14 [BrianFreud]
but you're again making a judgement call
04:30:18 [cooperaa]
I don't think so
04:30:25 [cooperaa]
would you label it if you could?
04:30:27 [cooperaa]
label it live?
04:30:37 [BrianFreud]
you said the presence of 5 tracks from a studio overrode the 15 tracks that were live
04:30:42 [cooperaa]
if its a live release, it doesn't matter at the moment if its a compilation too
04:30:47 [BrianFreud]
where is the cutoff?
04:31:00 [BrianFreud]
all I know is,
04:31:04 [cooperaa]
if they aren't bonus tracks then its a comp
04:31:07 [BrianFreud]
on any bootleg reference site I go to,
04:31:07 [cooperaa]
if they are bonus its live
04:31:15 [drsaunde]
1/2 +1...its supposed to be the majority
04:31:16 [BrianFreud]
you get three groups.
04:31:28 [BrianFreud]
single concert, dual concert, compilation
04:31:37 [cooperaa]
okay I understand you
04:31:49 [cooperaa]
so what we need to be able to do is say "X is a Live Compilation"
04:31:53 [cooperaa]
but we can't
04:31:55 [BrianFreud]
drsaunde: then how is 15/5 compilation? it's not 1/2 +1...
04:32:13 [drsaunde]
i would classify that as live...as the majority of the tracks are so
04:32:28 [drsaunde]
that is directly from the official wiki
04:32:30 [BrianFreud]
cooperaa: exactly, hence why I have a fudged definition to at least make SOME sense of it for the moment
04:32:36 [cooperaa]
I don't think majority is a good way to do this
04:32:53 [cooperaa]
what if a band plays very very long songs?
04:33:11 [drsaunde]
like the Allmans
04:33:13 [cooperaa]
and they have a single-track EP that is 40 minutes long, but has two live tracks tagged on the end that are each 4 mins long for bonus material
04:33:41 [cooperaa]
I don't think you could argue that is a live release if the band intended it to be an album or ep
04:33:58 [cooperaa]
(obviously I meant three track EP, with one track that is 40 mins :) )
04:34:08 [BrianFreud]
drsaunde:
04:34:11 [drsaunde]
point taken..but in that case...the majority of the material is still EP
04:34:19 [BrianFreud]
wasn't ignoring you, was looking back through the log a sec
04:34:21 [cooperaa]
fair enough
04:34:28 [cooperaa]
:)
04:34:42 [cooperaa]
okay well, that's enough debating for one night :)
04:34:51 [drsaunde]
agreed...sleepy time
04:34:53 [cooperaa]
gotta get up for work tomorrow and I want to squeeze some South Park in before sleep
04:34:53 [BrianFreud]
drsaunde: you just said 15/5 you could call live. I looked back and found cooperaa's answer to the same question...
04:34:55 [BrianFreud]
"<BrianFreud> What is it?
04:34:55 [BrianFreud]
<cooperaa> compilation
04:34:56 [BrianFreud]
"
04:34:56 [drsaunde]
Go Raptors!
04:34:58 [BrianFreud]
lol
04:35:04 [cooperaa]
hehehe :)
04:35:10 [cooperaa]
I would say comp unless they were bonus*
04:35:14 [BrianFreud]
all I'm saying is it's grey. later we fix. :P
04:35:21 [drsaunde]
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04:35:22 [cooperaa]
alright
04:35:26 [BrianFreud]
cooperaa: agreed
04:35:30 [cooperaa]
* cooperaa prays for multiple release attributes ;)
04:35:35 [BrianFreud]
yup
04:35:38 [cooperaa]
hehe
04:35:41 [cooperaa]
catchya later
04:35:58 [BrianFreud]
how about a soundtrack with live tracks plus studio demos?
04:35:59 [BrianFreud]
LOL
04:36:04 [cooperaa]
lol good night
04:36:06 [BrianFreud]
* BrianFreud stops being a prick
04:36:10 [BrianFreud]
see ya cooper`
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04:41:17 [BrianFreud]
good debate guys :)
04:59:24 [Jugdish]
sigh
04:59:37 [Jugdish]
how many more days of 502's must we endure? :((
05:16:43 [BrianFreud]
Ruoak said tonight's a bandaid, but better performance is on the way
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07:24:07 [BrianFreud]
wb ruoak, how was the bike ride?
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dmp_ is now known as workingmoose
07:44:30 [BrianFreud]
hail dmppanda
07:44:38 [BrianFreud]
bon soir
07:44:47 [BrianFreud]
ca va?
07:44:56 [workingmoose]
bonjour Brian ;)
07:45:07 [workingmoose]
oui, ça va
07:45:21 [BrianFreud]
ca va bien, merci
07:45:54 [workingmoose]
BrianFreud: not yet sleeping, or already awaken? :p
07:46:15 [BrianFreud]
not yet sleeping
07:46:36 [BrianFreud]
j'ai vu votre commentaire concernant le wiki
07:46:59 [workingmoose]
which one? LiveBootlegStyle?
07:47:19 [BrianFreud]
no, le label
07:47:23 [BrianFreud]
oui... je n'ai pas une ligne
07:47:37 [workingmoose]
ok ;) did it helped?
07:48:02 [BrianFreud]
yes... but I think one line may have lost something in the translation
07:48:40 [workingmoose]
ok... can you give me the link and an indication what's wrong?
07:48:41 [BrianFreud]
you have a line in which you refer to bootleg production companies reissuing re-etc re-etc...
07:48:46 [BrianFreud]
sure, looking now
07:50:05 [workingmoose]
* workingmoose opens up tha mailbox and is immediately drown under morning mail
07:50:30 [Freso]
* Freso so regrets not taking French classes in primary school :/
07:51:02 [workingmoose]
Freso: peut-être n'est-il pas trop tard ;)
07:51:15 [Freso]
workingmoose: Exactly.
07:51:19 [Freso]
:(
07:52:42 [BrianFreud]
oui, et Français n'est pas aussi dur - aussi longtemps que vous ne devez pas lui dactylographier :P
07:53:01 [BrianFreud]
that may not be exactly right :P
07:53:09 [BrianFreud]
here's the line I refer to:
07:53:11 [BrianFreud]
"For bootlegs companies, or if the date of the agreement is hard/impossible to find, you may use the date of the first reissue made by the reissuer label from the reissued label catalog. "
07:53:17 [BrianFreud]
http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/LabelReissueRelationshipType?highlight=%28RelationshipType%24%29%7C%28AdvancedRelationshipType%29%7C%28%28BusinessAssociationRelationshipClass%29%29
07:53:52 [workingmoose]
ok. well it's not *that* clear and not well writen, I sure agree, but is it missing something?
07:54:03 [BrianFreud]
There is a (slight) distinction between bootleg companies and pirate production companies
07:56:13 [BrianFreud]
when you use the words "bootlegs companies", I think you may mean "pirate production companies"
07:56:15 [workingmoose]
well... not necessarily... there is no clear delimitation.
07:56:15 [BrianFreud]
bootleg company = company releasing unauthorized recording of concert
07:56:16 [BrianFreud]
pirate company = company releasing unauthorized copy of authorized work
07:56:16 [workingmoose]
Some jazz labels dead for decades are "sleeping" somewhere in the vaults of right owners
07:56:18 [workingmoose]
though, some UK or Spanish or IT are reissuing their catalog, without proper agreement, but in legal conditions (due to legal holes)
07:56:18 [BrianFreud]
not sure I see your point...
07:56:18 [BrianFreud]
right
07:56:18 [workingmoose]
these are not comparable to "pirate" like we understand it nowadays
07:56:18 [BrianFreud]
in english, at least, those would be pirate releases more than bootleg releases
07:56:18 [workingmoose]
which is why I don't draw a clear limit
07:56:31 [workingmoose]
they might even add previously unreleased material etc
07:56:43 [Freso]
workingmoose: I take it you want to move http://mb.o/a/XXXXXXX.html to wiki:Artist:XXXXXXXX?
07:56:45 [Freso]
(Wiki)
07:56:46 [BrianFreud]
well, typically, when you read "bootleg", you think concert, not unauth studio
07:57:27 [workingmoose]
* workingmoose phone
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07:57:52 [BrianFreud]
just a line that caught my eye as confusing... I threw it to the room here 5 hours or so ago, and noone could figure out quite what it meant :P
07:58:31 [ruaok]
* ruaok pokes his head back in
07:58:42 [BrianFreud]
Je suis curieux - où en France êtes-vous ?
07:58:46 [ruaok]
BrianFreud: the ride was nice. windy, but nice.
07:58:50 [BrianFreud]
:)
07:59:24 [BrianFreud]
server was blazing for a while... then it started having 502s about 3, 4 hrs ago
07:59:37 [workingmoose]
Freso: yes. Is that a problem?
07:59:50 [BrianFreud]
for a while though, it was the fastest I've seen in a while
08:02:03 [Freso]
workingmoose: Nono. :) I'm just going to help then! :D
08:02:03 [Freso]
workingmoose: I also just found a couple of Wikipedia non-interwiki links.
08:02:44 [workingmoose]
BrianFreud: re: bootleg. I don't agree. Bootlegs is wider than that (eg: wider than "concert"). There is a wide variety of them, and the late flac-leak-freakin' wave is just a part of it.
08:02:44 [workingmoose]
Freso: cool ;)
08:02:45 [BrianFreud]
ruaok and workingmoose: if you would, when you have a moment, take a look at last night's log. I'd be curious to hear what you think about some sort of SpecialPurpose artist listing for classical works as AR targets in the sense we talked about
08:02:45 [ruaok]
BrianFreud: can you find the right spot on chatlogs.musicbrainz.org ?
08:02:45 [workingmoose]
BrainFreud: I'm located in Paris. I guess I'm linked on the Frappr MusicBrainz map in case you want to see where Paris is :P
08:02:45 [workingmoose]
s/Brain/Brian/ (second time I do this funny typo)
08:02:45 [BrianFreud]
workingmoose: oh, I know - by the way, I get the sense from some of the notes you've left... I'm not a huge fan of the homebrews and such, just that seems the latest way most concerts also get distributed
08:02:45 [Freso]
workingmoose: (Actually, I already started helping with that last night, but... >_>)
08:03:17 [BrianFreud]
lol, I was telling the others earlier, I had to switch to "Brain Food" at one point on a diff system cause I got that misspelling so often :P
08:05:04 [BrianFreud]
workingmoose: Curieux justes... J'ai habit Tours pendant une période courte vers la fin des années 80
08:05:23 [BrianFreud]
Je ne parle pas Francais plus bien maintenant, :(
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08:08:56 [workingmoose]
BrianFreud: re: pirate. A "pirate" is supposed to be a counterfeit identical to the original release, right?
08:09:03 [BrianFreud]
oui
08:10:40 [BrianFreud]
mais un "bootleg" = une concert, at least in common parliance
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08:10:41 [workingmoose]
then I really mean "bootleg" in the wiki page. In the meaning of "release containing material issued without agreement from the rights owner", as a general definition (that encompass pirate)
08:10:51 [BrianFreud]
there, yes
08:11:16 [BrianFreud]
but when you talk about a re-release of an existing official work, I think you mean a pirated copy, not a bootleg
08:14:38 [BrianFreud]
it's the same semantic differance as hacker vs cracker vs etc
08:14:38 [workingmoose]
I want to encompass more than "straight" reissue (pirate), but all kind of unlegit compilations, with or without unreleased stuff.
08:14:39 [workingmoose]
maybe bootleg is bad terminology
08:14:39 [workingmoose]
but I'm clearly not refering to "pirate" only.
08:14:39 [workingmoose]
what term would be better?
08:14:39 [BrianFreud]
right - how would a bootleg of a concert be included in "first reissue made by the reissuer label from the reissued label catalog."?
08:14:39 [workingmoose]
unlegit? baaa
08:14:39 [BrianFreud]
lol
08:14:39 [workingmoose]
think vaults
08:14:39 [BrianFreud]
just use "pirated copy"
08:14:39 [workingmoose]
don't think "release"
08:14:41 [BrianFreud]
or "unofficially sanctioned"
08:14:41 [BrianFreud]
or even "unsanctioned"
08:14:43 [workingmoose]
"unofficially sanctioned record companies"? béééééééé :p
08:15:00 [BrianFreud]
"a unsanctioned release"?
08:15:43 [BrianFreud]
otherwise I'll have to type "du du du la bébé" at you all night long... :P
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08:19:16 [BrianFreud]
Merde... je souhait que je n'oublier autant de la Francais comme j'ai....
08:19:16 [workingmoose]
BrianFreud: Ok, I'm supposed to be working right now (see my nick?) :p - so, *you* edit the WikiWardening page and you add a note at the bottom, in the section: http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/WikiWardening#head-010df30b4b6539c77abbbbfa1a67aa06f1075bab --> where you explain your problem there with the "BadTerminology" (<--- use that WikiTag) use of "bootleg" throughout the documentation.
08:19:16 [BrianFreud]
ok, will do in the morning when I'm awake enough to do it right :)
08:19:58 [BrianFreud]
(and pardon the bad French) :P
08:22:03 [BrianFreud]
anyhow, goodnight all
08:22:18 [BrianFreud]
BrianFreud is now known as BrainAsleep
08:28:21 [workingmoose]
BrianFreud: for when you awake. Forget about my previous note. I'm handling this issue afterall.
08:30:29 [Jugdish]
son of a...
08:30:29 [Jugdish]
site's down again :(
08:31:14 [ruaok]
* ruaok tries out a couple more band aids
08:31:24 [ruaok]
should be back up in a few.
08:31:26 [ruaok]
* ruaok hopes
08:31:31 [Jugdish]
k
08:32:29 [HairMetalAddict]
Have you tried name-brand band aids instead of the generic ones? Sure, the generics are cheaper, but they'll rip yer hair out painfully when you try and take 'em off.
08:32:36 [HairMetalAddict]
Er, never mind. ;-)
08:33:17 [ruaok]
lol
08:36:19 [ruaok]
back
08:36:19 [Jugdish]
* Jugdish cheers :D
08:36:19 [ruaok]
* ruaok hopes he's coddled it enough for the night
08:36:19 [ruaok]
* ruaok runs off to try and relax before bed
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10:02:04 [workingmoose]
Shepard?
10:10:12 [Muz]
Moose :D
10:10:28 [workingmoose]
hé
10:11:40 [Aankhen``]
* Aankhen`` leopards Muz.
10:12:11 [workingmoose]
Muz: I thought about you the other day. I codenamed a project as "gMoose" (short for graph-a-moose) - if it ever get released publicly, I'll sneak you into the credits somehow :D
10:13:02 [Muz]
:D:D:D
10:13:06 [Muz]
* Muz <3 workingmoose
10:16:03 [Aankhen``]
Muz: I actually converted a lot of Perl 5 code to use Moose today.
10:16:03 [Muz]
:D
10:16:03 [Aankhen``]
But it's still only like 15% done. I have a huge amount remaining.
10:16:04 [Muz]
I'm working on a new project in ZDE, and I've named it "moose"
10:16:04 [Muz]
Then again, I name most things "moose" when I just want to enter the first word that comes to mind
10:16:04 [Aankhen``]
LOL.
10:16:04 [Muz]
It means late night, drunk, coding always have fifty bajillion variables, all variants of "moose
10:16:04 [workingmoose]
xmlns:moose
10:16:04 [workingmoose]
* workingmoose goes to eat something
10:16:05 [Muz]
list($moose0, $moose1) = explode(',', $moose); etc
10:16:14 [Muz]
Makes it look like perl, unreadable :D
10:17:57 [Aankhen``]
LMAO. Mooooooooose.
10:18:23 [Aankhen``]
http://search.cpan.org/~stevan/Moose-0.20/lib/Moose.pm # seriously, look at the SYNOPSIS for that and tell me how you can find it unreadable.
10:19:11 [Muz]
Ooh
10:19:51 [FauxFaux]
Noes, perl!
10:19:58 [Aankhen``]
FauxFaux: Read it, you wuss.
10:20:06 [FauxFaux]
Butbut perl!
10:20:11 [Aankhen``]
READ IT OR WEEP
10:20:18 [FauxFaux]
The only good thing that came out of perl was the regexes.
10:20:23 [Aankhen``]
Actually, that SYNOPSIS is slightly outdated.
10:20:36 [Aankhen``]
The `use strict;` and `use warnings;` are taken care of by Moose itself.
10:20:50 [Aankhen``]
FauxFaux: Super-wuss.
10:20:58 [Aankhen``]
Perl is teh sex0rz.
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10:31:56 [Jugdish]
whoa...
10:31:59 [Jugdish]
could it be true?
10:32:12 [Jugdish]
ModBot copies edit notes on batch edits now?
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10:34:09 [cooperaa]
ah shoot, I duped some release events :P
10:34:09 [cooperaa]
http://musicbrainz.org/show/edit/?editid=6781670
10:34:20 [cooperaa]
please y-bomb me
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11:11:18 [Freso]
Y-bomb dropped.
11:12:12 [cooperaa]
merci :)
11:12:32 [Freso]
It should be cleared on next ModBot round.
11:21:10 [Muz_]
MooseBot
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13:22:21 [nightgroove]
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13:22:25 [catgroove]
jesus crist
13:22:47 [catgroove]
!slap BrainAsleep
13:22:47 [BrainzBot]
* BrainzBot smashes BrainAsleep viciously with a huge fork
13:22:53 [catgroove]
>(
13:23:13 [catgroove]
also stay the FSCK away from [spiritual]
13:23:19 [catgroove]
yarr
13:23:46 [warp]
goodmorning mo?
13:23:49 [catgroove]
sorry
13:23:54 [catgroove]
hi warpen ^__^
13:23:59 [warp]
hi :)
13:24:10 [warp]
* warp needs more time for mb stuff.
13:24:27 [catgroove]
I just read the bit about using [spiritual] instead of [taditional] for christmas songs and flipped
13:24:47 [catgroove]
oh hey
13:24:49 [warp]
ah, that does seem a bit odd.
13:24:51 [catgroove]
mb works slightly
13:24:53 [catgroove]
yea
13:25:02 [catgroove]
also there is way to much stuff talk now
13:25:05 [warp]
that's what goes in the artist field or something?
13:25:07 [catgroove]
can't read the backscroll
13:25:18 [warp]
* warp never used either.
13:25:52 [catgroove]
what I've been doing (and x-mas sctuffage is on my TODOlist of d00m â„¢) is the composer of said tune
13:25:57 [catgroove]
(there are some ace websites)
13:26:02 [catgroove]
then use performer with ar
13:26:37 [catgroove]
or the performer as artist and composer with ar
13:26:39 [catgroove]
doesn't mater
13:26:42 [catgroove]
matter
13:26:54 [catgroove]
often on some low key xmas releases there are no artists
13:27:03 [catgroove]
jist 'this random tune blah'
13:27:28 [warp]
* warp nods.
13:27:39 [catgroove]
lol
13:27:41 [warp]
* warp needs an iptables wizard
13:29:28 [catgroove]
I'm AR'ing stuff to bands in my VAalbum series, and have gotten to Jo Jo Gunne, there is already an 'jay ferguson' in the database (two infact) and its artist note is "70's solo artist and member of the bands Spirit and Jo Jo Gunne" (but he is *not* ARed to Jo Jo Gunne yet! XD)
13:33:37 [catgroove]
must fix loads
13:33:38 [catgroove]
yay
13:40:08 [catgroove]
god discogs are screwed up
13:40:13 [catgroove]
there is 3 jay ferguson
13:40:48 [catgroove]
one is accociated with a 'spirit' but that's not the same 'spirit' that's linked to *our* 'spirit'
13:40:52 [Synchro]
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13:41:07 [catgroove]
(wich is psychedelick rock)
13:41:09 [Synchro]
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13:41:15 [warp]
ouch.
13:41:22 [catgroove]
http://www.discogs.com/artist/Spirit+(8)
13:41:35 [catgroove]
http://www.discogs.com/artist/Jay+Ferguson
13:41:51 [catgroove]
there is a bogusartist accociated with the 'the terminator' soundtrack that I want to fix
13:42:15 [catgroove]
and it says that *my* (jo jo gunne and spirit) jay ferguson is it
13:42:19 [catgroove]
but how can I be sure?
13:42:36 [catgroove]
the third jay ferguson is http://www.discogs.com/artist/Jay+Ferguson+(3)
13:43:05 [catgroove]
god how complicated and obviously bogus
13:44:27 [catgroove]
how how now, the right spirit is linked
13:44:42 [Synchro]
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13:44:58 [catgroove]
i'm still confused
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13:49:11 [catgroove]
ok
13:49:18 [catgroove]
seems to have nested up all the pieces
13:49:20 [catgroove]
yay
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14:00:31 [catgroove]
hi shep
14:00:36 [Shepard]
hei
14:00:42 [catgroove]
:D
14:00:56 [Shepard]
how are you gentlemen?
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14:01:08 [catgroove]
all your base are belong to us
14:01:46 [Shepard]
I take that as a "fine" ;)
14:01:54 [catgroove]
mrrhh
14:01:54 [catgroove]
:)
14:03:23 [catgroove]
:OOOOOOO
14:03:28 [catgroove]
omg these AR's
14:03:30 [Muz_]
Mooooose
14:03:33 [catgroove]
moose
14:03:36 [catgroove]
yea ok listento this
14:03:44 [catgroove]
i'm arign this ferguson bloke
14:03:53 [catgroove]
then I ar all the members of his band 'spirit'
14:04:30 [catgroove]
one of the members is this John Locke (snicker) and he was once member of Nazareth!
14:04:32 [catgroove]
:o
14:04:36 [catgroove]
this is so fun
14:04:47 [catgroove]
* catgroove er helt forelsket i AR
14:06:02 [catgroove]
rofl http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Locke_(disambiguation)
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14:12:43 [FauxFaux]
Anyone have suggestions for a tool that handles mp3 files with multiple conflicting id3 tags in them?
14:21:42 [workingmoose]
which platform?
14:22:26 [FauxFaux]
Don't care. Windows by default. :)
14:22:51 [workingmoose]
mm. I've obtained good results on all sort of "broken" stuff with mutagen. (http://www.sacredchao.net/quodlibet/wiki/Development/Mutagen)
14:23:25 [FauxFaux]
I should have answered "please, god, anything but python" to platform, shouldn't I. :)
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14:35:16 [warp]
FauxFaux: haha.
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14:42:42 [catgroove]
that reminds me
14:44:08 [catgroove]
catgroove has changed the topic to: http://musicbrainz.org | http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/CollaborationOfTheMonth stopped being the Dire Straits a while ago, but I don't remember what it's called the guy we agreed upon | Forums! http://forums.musicbrainz.org/ | New Picard rewritten with Qt http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/PicardQt (Version: Alpha 8)
14:44:31 [FauxFaux]
"what it's called the guy we agreed upon"?
14:44:34 [catgroove]
* catgroove is sick of the whining about 'dire straits' is the colab of the month for ever omg whine whine'
14:45:00 [catgroove]
someone agreed that we should change it to.. uh someguy cause that guy needed more help
14:45:13 [catgroove]
but I don't remember who it was, or whatt he name is
14:45:18 [catgroove]
I there fore, suck
14:45:19 [Muz_]
"FauxFaux"
14:45:23 [Muz_]
FauxFaux needs more help
14:45:27 [Muz_]
He's craaaaaazy
14:45:28 [catgroove]
no
14:45:32 [Muz_]
He's also wumpy
14:45:34 [catgroove]
he didn't have a camel case name
14:45:42 [FauxFaux]
FauxFaux has drugs, not crazy for hours now! :D
14:45:50 [Muz_]
Wumpy Faux
14:45:54 [catgroove]
tom perry or tim waits or thingy mcbob
14:45:58 [FauxFaux]
Soomes.
14:46:08 [Muz_]
Yonpies
14:46:17 [catgroove]
o_O
14:46:19 [catgroove]
hæ?
14:47:55 [FauxFaux]
Wouldn't that be Onpyies?
14:48:39 [catgroove]
amscray?
14:48:47 [Muz_]
Catmoose
14:48:57 [catgroove]
moooooo
14:48:57 [Muz_]
Long cat is loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong
14:49:02 [catgroove]
oi da
14:49:06 [catgroove]
hmm
14:49:12 [catgroove]
catgroove is now known as catgrooooooooooo
14:49:22 [catgrooooooooooo]
catgrooooooooooo is now known as catgrooooooooove
14:49:24 [FauxFaux]
* FauxFaux finds http://faux.uwcs.co.uk/longcat.jpg, and it wasn't even the one I was after. :p
14:49:28 [Shepard]
ja jøss
14:49:33 [catgrooooooooove]
hi sheppi
14:49:33 [Muz_]
Hah
14:49:40 [Shepard]
again?
14:49:46 [Muz_]
Good hello Shepard
14:50:06 [catgrooooooooove]
shepard you need an animal, muz has moose, faux has ponies
14:50:08 [catgrooooooooove]
I cats
14:50:14 [Muz_]
Sheep
14:50:20 [Shepard]
I don't like animals
14:50:22 [catgrooooooooove]
nhmnhmm
14:50:24 [Muz_]
* Muz_ snickers
14:50:27 [catgrooooooooove]
bad pun that's not really a pun
14:50:29 [FauxFaux]
http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/index.php/Image:Loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooongcat.JPG was the one I was thinking of. ED++
14:50:33 [Shepard]
they're hairy
14:50:51 [catgrooooooooove]
wtf long cats
14:51:10 [catgrooooooooove]
* catgrooooooooove bludgeons sheppi for not liking animals
14:51:38 [Shepard]
bludgeons?
14:51:54 [Muz_]
It's a perfectly cromulent word
14:52:26 [catgrooooooooove]
ROFLMAO "ragnaöfl"
14:53:14 [Shepard]
this reminds me of the ultra long paintbrush pic
14:53:17 [catgrooooooooove]
* catgrooooooooove laughed at the name
14:54:00 [ajh]
So, counting untitled/blank tracks as 'missing' seems silly.
14:54:38 [catgrooooooooove]
catgrooooooooove is now known as catgroove
14:54:47 [catgroove]
lol ragnaröfl
14:55:04 [catgroove]
* catgroove pronounced it in norwegian and laughs some more
14:57:44 [Muz_]
Elghund
14:57:51 [Muz_]
Moosedogs do exist :D
14:58:17 [ajh]
Elk Hounds.
14:58:22 [Muz_]
Yup
14:58:35 [ajh]
Elk != Moose
14:58:42 [Muz_]
Elg != elk
14:58:57 [Muz_]
And they are the same thinh
14:59:03 [Muz_]
Moose is the North American term for them
14:59:58 [Muz_]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norsk_Elghund_Black
15:05:44 [FauxFaux]
ELG.
15:09:05 [Muz_]
ElGER
15:09:53 [russss]
"easier to recognize in the snow"
15:10:49 [Muz_]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karelian_Bear_Dog
15:10:54 [Muz_]
The name alone is awesome
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15:23:19 [alkos333]
Does id3v1 not support workart?
15:23:32 [FauxFaux]
id3v1 doesn't support anything.
15:24:16 [alkos333]
FauxFaux: And xmms v1 doesn't support id3v2 - Great!
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15:25:01 [FauxFaux]
Really? That's pretty legendarily old.
15:25:23</